10-02-2002 DRC MinutesCITY OF ORANGE
DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE
MINUTE S
Wednesday, October 2, 2002
Committee Members Present: Jon Califf
Leonard Filner (Vice Chair)
Craig Wheeler
Joe Woollett (Chair)
Staff in Attendance: Chuck Lau, Associate Planner
Howard Morris, Landscape Coordinator
Debbie Ritchey, Recording Secretary
Committee Member Absent: Mark Paone
Administrative Session - 4:30 P.M.
The committee met for an administrative session beginning at 4:30 p.m. The meeting adjourned
at approximately 8:10 p.m.
Regular Session - 5:30 PM
REVIEW OF MINUTES:
A motion was made by Committee Member Leonard Filner to approve the September 18, 2002
meeting minutes with the following corrections:
DRC #3762 Shell Gas Station page 4 paragraph 10 sentence 1 amended as follows:
Committee Member Filner recommended that the applicant consider simplifying
e~~ ~ ' ~ '""`'"" r b the plants by reducing the number of different
varieties that already exist.
DRC #3780 -Chapman Universit~Parking Lot pale 10 paragraph 6 sentence 1 amended as
follows:
Mr. Olsen replied it is due to e€ economics.
SECOND: Jon Califf
AYES: Leonard Filner, Jon Califf, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Mark Paone
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 2
1. DRC No. 3699-02 -SAINT MARY'S SERIAC ORTHODOX CHURCH
Revised building elevations for the expansion of an existing church facility.
1515 E. Taft Avenue
Staff Contact: Daniel Ryan, Senior Planner -Historic Preservation
DRC Action: Final Determination
Continued from 9- I 1-2002 meeting)
Approved as Consent Item)
A motion was made by Committee Chair Joe Woollett to approve the project based on the
findings listed in the staff report, and subject to the following conditions:
1. The roofing material and exterior plaster finish for the new fellowship building shall match
the existing sanctuary building in terms of color and texture.
SECOND: Leonard Filner
AYES: Jon Califf, Leonard Filner, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES : None
ABSENT: Mark Paone
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 3
2. DRC No. 3778-02 - VALDEZ RETAIL CENTER
Removal of an existing wood canopy and addition of a new standing seam metal canopy.
412-420 W. Lincoln Avenue
Staff Contact: Jeffry Rice, Planning Manager
DRC Action: Final Determination
Continued from 9-18-2002 meeting)
Diane and Robert Bohack (owners/applicants), presented the project. Additional information has
been submitted and plans have been revised to address the issues that were raised by the
committee from the previous meeting. She also mentioned her meeting with. Brad Beyer of the
Orange Police Department and that he was very helpful. Mr. Beyer suggested the use of a non-
climbable chain-link fence that has smaller openings in lieu of the barbed wire. The new fence
should be eight (8) feet in height to secure the back area. She asked Mr. Jeff Rice, Planning
Manager, to assist them in the variance process for an 8 ft. high fence. As for lighting of the
parking lot area, the building is hidden and she wanted some way to make the area brighter. Mr.
Beyer conducted a light meter reading of the property and was surprised with how well the lights
worked. Ms. Bohack also presented the exterior material and color samples, as well as a color
rendering of the building.
A motion was made by Committee Chair Joe Woollett to approve the project based on the
findings listed in the staff report, and subject to the following conditions:
1. Exterior lighting shall be installed in accordance with the Orange Police Department Crime
Prevention Bureau recommendations.
2. The new metal canopy shall be installed over the exposed framing of the building in
accordance with the attached detail. (The canopy band to be a single plane in an east-west
direction)
3. Sierra Green (Middle Sales Co.) color is approved for the metal canopy.
4. Fencing along the southern property line to be 8 ft. in height with small diamond chain link
fencing in accordance with the recommendations of the Orange Police Department Crime
Prevention Bureau. (Note: 8 ft. high fence requires variance approval.)
5. The existing colors that have been recently painted on the building are acceptable.
SECOND: Leonard Filner
AYES: Jon Califf, Leonard Filner, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Mark Paone
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 4
3. DRC No. 3716-02 - CINGULAR WIRELESS
Installation of stealth wireless communication antenna and associated equipment
cabinets within an underground vault.
123 E. Collins Avenue
Staff Contact: Mario Chavez-Marquez, Assistant Planner
DRC Action: Final Determination
Continued from 9-4-2002 meeting)
Brian Stotlemeyer with The Consulting Group, Inc., representing Cingular Wireless, stated that
changes have been made to the project since the last DRC meeting. As discussed in the previous
DRC, the antenna location has been moved towards the corner of Collins and Glassell, and
landscaping has also been incorporated. By moving things around, it has created more parking
in the parking lot. Some of the entrances/drive aisles have been closed off. Revising the site
location and closing some existing driveways has provided additional parking.
Committee Member Wheeler asked how the proposed antenna compared to the palm tree tower
on Glassell by the 22 freeway. Mr. Stotlemeyer answered they would be similar; the Glassell
one is a Date Palm with the one for this project being a Mexican Fan Palm.
Committee Member Leonard Filner asked if the vault had been lowered below grade, to which
Mr. Stotlemeyer answered yes, that it had the additional 12" to 3'. Part of Mr. Filner's concern
was not so much the stealthing of the mono palm, but the stealthing of the corner site, to make it
blend in more without any additional palms of similar species as it still stands out. Mr. Filner
wondered if the applicant would be willing to add additional Washingtonias down both sides
three on Glassell and three on Collins), and Mr. Stotlemeyer answered that if this were a
condition of approval, they would do it. He did ask what would be the required box size. Mr.
Filner said they would have to go the same height (40-45 foot -palms); they could be a
minimum of 30'.
Mr. Stotlemeyer said from his understanding the owner will be maintaining the area.
Committee Member Filner said that if palm trees are added, the lawn needs to be removed and
plants, shrubbery and ground cover need to be added within a year.
A motion was made by Committee Member Leonard Filner to approve the project based on the
findings listed in the staff report, and subject to the following conditions:
1. Plant 6 additional Washingtonia robusta/Mexican Fan Palms with a minimum height of
30' brown trunk height. Locating 3 along Glassell and 3 along Collins.
2. Remove the grass area along Glassell (to face a projected curb line along length of
parking stalls) and along Collins (to the future property line for the length of parking
stalls that face Collins). To be replaced with shrub, ground cover mixture comparable to
what is in other areas. And to also include recommendations by staff.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 5
SECOND:Craig Wheeler
AYES:Jon Califf, Leonard Filner, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES:None
ABSENT:Mark Paone
ABSTAINED:None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 6
4. DRC No. 3747-02 -FIELDSTONE COMMUNITIES, INC.
Construction of a new 24 dwelling unit residential development.
South side of Heim Avenue 300 feet east of Canal Street
Staff Contact: Christopher Carnes, Senior Planner
DRC Action: Preliminary Review of proposed site, building, landscaping, and walls
plans.
Presentation was made by David Greminger with Fieldstone Communities, Shawn Schuler of
Edinger Architects, Paul Wong with Land Arch West, and Warren Williams with Development
Resources. Mr. Greminger made a request to change the recommended action from Preliminary
Review to Final Determination.
Committee Chair Joe Woollett stated if that's what they want and are asking, the Committee
would do what they could.
Mr. Greminger started with a high level overview of the project design and then into landscape
architecture.
Committee Chair Joe Woollett made a statement that 2 of the Committee members were
involved in the original acceptance of the previous entitlements and 2 were not.
Committee Chair Joe Woollett asked about the perimeter walls. Mr. Williams addressed where
they exist and what is proposed. There is a wall along both Mall frontages. Walls will be kept in
place but will be mitigated (touch up paint). The Landscape Architect will address walls on the
north and west.
Committee Chair Joe Woollett stated this plan is for 8 units per acre and wondered what the
other plan was for. The answer to this was not immediately available. Mr. Williams believes the
current plans are for far less density but is unable to quote the numbers.
Paul Wong continued with the presentation. It will be a single entrance site. They have made
arrangements for atot-lot area that will be maintained by the HOA as will all maintenance
streets, park areas and all perimeter landscaping). They have entered into an agreement (based
on recommendation from SRC) to install a landscape buffer. They have agreed with the church
to put an easement in this area, which Fieldstone will do the planting and maintain for the life of
the project. At that time the church will take over the maintenance of the area.
The discussion continued on the walls:
Setbacks
Groundcover (would be low)
Landscaping and plants to be used
Name of project on walls entering project
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 7
Fence along driveway
Tot-Lot area (ages 2-5)
Sidewalks
Project signage
Committee Member Craig Wheeler asked if there was any consideration in adding additional
landscaping along the south and east sides to reduce visibility to businesses. Mr. Greminger
answered they had discussed boundary conditions in SRC and how they would buffer that. It
was determined that existing landscaping along the two edges was sufficient. Fieldstone will be
adding landscaping with every unit but not rear yard landscaping. The existing landscaping on
the Malls land on the east and south sides is part of the conceptual plan before the group and will
be maintained by the Mall.
Committee Member Filner asked about the front yard landscaping and what it entailed per unit
and does this include any trees? Mr. Greminger answered irrigation, turf and planting areas,
some trees will be included.
Mr. Howard Morris informed Fieldstone that they would need to contact Doug Kokesh with the
Street Tree Department of Public Works to coordinate street trees, size and kind (phone: 532-
6470).
Next was a discussion of the building elevations. (Enhanced elevations and un-enhanced
elevations were shown.) Mr. Shawn Schuler presented the elevation portion of the project. The
building style is Spanish, Eclectic, Craftsman, and Italian. The following enhancements were
discussed
Wider Horizontal Band
The Decorative Lintels
Additional Pop-outs
Enhanced Window Treatments
Wood Shutters
Committee Member Wheeler asked a question regarding side views of the homes located on
Sycamore Lane being enhanced, and Mr. Schuler answered that there would be enhancements.
More color boards were shown to the Committee. There will be 4 colors (per style of home) to
choose from.
Committee Chair Woollett's primary concern is the size of the building relative to the size of the
property, landscaping, and also the lot sizes being the same size as originally but the proposed
houses are bigger. He did look at what was done before and Fieldstone has addressed many of
the previous concerns.
Committee Member Wheeler was concerned about the appearance of the whole project and
being surrounded by Wal-Mart, Radio Shack, Strouds, etc. It seems like this little island. He
thinks it needs some work in the planning.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 8
Committee Member Filner concurs with what Committee Chair Woollett said regarding the
relationship and proportion of the size of the lot with the size of the unit. The relative large
residential size seems overpowering. Building enhancement helps, but it doesn't solve the
problem, bearing in mind that the project is visible on 3 sides. The visual impacts are limited on
the east and south sides, plus it looks basically the same even with 3 variations. The structures
are oversized, and look like big boxes on small little lots. If there were a way of scaling back the
2"d stories by creating more variation between the 15' floors, that would be more palatable and
something he would consider in a final decision.
Committee Chair Woollett in looking at the layout again, says it looks like a continuous wall of
building with slight variations with the rear yard but basically what you have is a wall of flat
buildings with relative small spaces in between. It looks like they are trying to get as much
building as you possibly can on a small lot.
Committee Member Jon Califf looked at the previous plans and noticed the lots were smaller and
the units were considerably smaller but did allow for a bit more variation in streetscape. He is
also bothered by the fact that even though the plan works nicely, from the outside it looks like a
large block.
Committee Member Filner continued saying that to him the issue is not the front elevations; the
issue is from off-site looking on to the site. It's not the lst story, which is a concern, as the wall
and planting on the perimeter will cover that. It's everything above that. Everything goes the
same way, straight up and down with a 10' separation. The problem is really with the 2"~ story
the side and back views of the homes). The units are too much alike.
Mr. Williams wanted to reiterate that the church (co-applicant) plans to build a worship center of
decent size on that property which will soften that area facing Canal Street. Committee Member
Filner said they would not be able to address that at tonight's meeting as they don't have the
configurations for it and also it only addresses one side of the project and not the other two sides.
Mr. Schuler said that there is a possibility the roof lines could have more variations. Committee
Chair Woollett said it would be important for him to see a west and south elevation of the site.
It's those two elevations on the 2"d level, which are important.
Committee Member Wheeler suggested that a few of the homes have a cantilever on the back to
bring the whole 2°d floor out a couple of feet.
Committee Member Filner continued with Committee Chair Woollett's concern of placement on
the lot and asked if the applicant would be willing to change the configuration of the first floor,
to which they answered yes.
Committee Member Wheeler also asked if some of the front enhancements could vary in depth,
which also received a yes answer, and Mr. Wheeler felt this might help the streetscape.
Committee Chair Woollett is concerned with what the community sees.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 9
Mr. Greminger asked the question, if in their efforts to present something back to the committee
to address the concerns, is it acceptable to do a combination of some of the architectural
enhancements plus possibly some increased landscaping along that edge.
Committee Member Filner asked if they were planning on denser plant material to increase the
depth. Mr. Greminger said yes, by increasing the number and size of the trees along the west
side.
A discussion followed regarding building bulk and mass. Different ideas were exchanged on
what could be done to change the appearance of the elevations.
A motion was made by Committee Member Leonard Filner to continue the project based on the
above discussion.
SECOND: Craig Wheeler
AYES: Jon Califf, Leonard Filner, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Mark Paone
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 10
5. DRC No. 3775-02 - SALINAS RESIDENCE
The applicant proposes to build a new 1,982 square feet house and a 441 square feet
garage on a 6,600 square foot vacant residential parcel.
413 N. Cypress Street (Old Towne Historic District)
Staff Contact: Jeffry Rice, Planning Manager
DRC Action: Final Determination
Mr. Salinas presented the project and explained the changes that had been made since the last
meeting.
Windows
Chimney
French doors
Trim
Garage
Committee Chair Joe Woollett commented that the applicant has been very responsive.
Mr. Salinas said they are trying to be consistent with the neighborhood. Committee Member
Wheeler said that the building massing works well.
Hearing open to the pubic.
Janet Crenshaw - 464 N. Shaffer, The materials used for the windows and sidings are very
sympathetic to the surrounding Old Towne area and expressed her appreciation for this.
Committee Member Leonard Filner asked if the trim pieces would look the same as the
windows. Mr. Salinas answered that the trim pieces and window will be wood.
Committee Member Craig Wheeler questioned the rafters in the garage and suggested they be
either 2 x 6 or 2 x 8. He also explained to Mr. Salinas what he was looking for, and mentioned
the stucco in the porch column and that it should be changed to wood.
Committee Member Jon Califf said the exposed wood should be a certain type. The Committee
gave Mr. Salinas some suggestions.
The Committee discussed the roof materials, the garage doors, and the location of the water
heater. The Committee also discussed setbacks in regards to the concrete steps and driveway.
The consensus of the Committee members was that the revisions responded to their original
comments.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for October 2, 2002
Page 11
A motion was made by Committee Member Craig Wheeler to approve the project based on the
findings listed in the staff report, and subject to the following conditions:
1. 2 x 4 rafters with 2 x 6 minimum barge boards (structural with out riggers holding it)
supported by structural corbels.
2. The columns on the porch are to be smooth wood.
3. Garage doors are to look like two, separate 8' wide doors.
4. Smooth finish on the rafter board - 5" exposure.
5. Water heater placed on the inside of the building.
SECOND: Jon Califf
AYES: Jon Califf, Leonard Filner, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Mark Paone
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
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