08-05-2009 DRC MinutesCITY OF ORANGE
DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE
MINUTES -FINAL
August 5, 2009
Committee Members Present:
Committee Members Absent:
Adrienne Gladson
Tim McCormack
Craig Wheeler
Bill Cathcart
Joe Woollett
Staff in Attendance: Leslie Aranda Roseberry, Planning Manager
Anne Fox, Contract Staff Planner
Chad Ortlieb, Senior Planner
Doris Nguyen, Associate Planner
Sonal Thakur, Assistant Planner
Sandi Dimick, Recording Secretary
Administrative Session - 5:00 P.M.
The Committee Members reviewed the minutes from the regular scheduled meeting of July 15,
2009. Changes and corrections were noted. Due to a lack of a quorum the approval of the
minutes would be held over to the next meeting.
Committee Member Wheeler asked on Consent Item No. 2 would a motion be necessary to
receive and file?
Leslie Aranda Roseberry, Planning Manager, stated that was correct. The item was being
presented for informational purposes only on the progress of certain components.
Chair McCormack asked if he could comment on the item?
Ms. Aranda Roseberry stated yes, it was just an update, but comments could be made. On
Wahoo's, the item had been scheduled for presentation, however, the applicant was unable to
attend the meeting. As it had been published in the public notice for distribution of the Negative
Declaration they kept it on the Agenda to be continued to a date certain of August 19, 2009.
Generally for DRC items there was no public noticing, but when an environmental document
was attached Staff was obligated to disclose the meeting dates.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to adjourn the Administrative Session.
SECOND: Adrienne Gladson
AYES:Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES:None
ABSTAIN:None
ABSENT:Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.
Administrative Session adjourned at 5:16 p.m.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 2 of 16
Regular Session - 5:30 P.M.
ROLL CALL:
PUBLIC PARTICIPATION:
Opportunity for members of the public to address the Design Review Committee on
matters not listed on the Agenda.
There was none.
CONSENT ITEMS:
All matters that are announced as Consent Items are considered to be routine by the
Design Review Committee and will be enacted by one motion. There will be no separate
discussion of said items unless members of the Design Review Committee, staff or the
public request specific items to be removed from the Consent Items for separate action.
1) APPROVAL OF MINUTES: July 15, 2009
Due to lack of a quorum the approval of the minutes was moved to the next regular scheduled
Design Review Committee on Wednesday, August 19, 2009.
2) DRC No. 4209-07 - CHOC MASTER PLAN (Response to Project Conditions)
A comprehensive expansion of the properties and facilities serving as the Children's
Hospital of Orange County (CHOC) project was previously approved by the City Council
on March 24, 2009. The DRC reviewed and made recommendations on the project at
their February 4, 2009 meeting. Three specific conditions of approval were added related
to design concepts. This item provides an update on these conditions.
455, 505, 541, & 557 S. Main Street & 1201 La Veta Avenue
Staff Contact: Anne Fox, 714-744-7229, afox(a,cityoforange.org
DRC Action: Receive and file
Chair McCormack had questions on the presentation and opened the item for discussion. He
stated he had a comment on Item No. 1 regarding the curb on the entrance area. In reviewing the
plan, and he could have it all wrong, when he had presented his suggestions the idea was to
present a zero curb in an area he pointed out on the plans. He reviewed the plans with the
applicant, Fred Talarico and Contract Staff Planner, Anne Fox.
Ms. Fox stated all the zero curbing had been highlighted with the ramping situation. During a
previous meeting CHOC had studied the recommendations and in particular one of the things
that was cited was a reference to what occurred at the Aquarium of the Pacific, something that
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 3 of 16
would decompress the driver and recognized that pedestrian traffic could travel back and forth.
Ultimately, they found that there were some drainage issues that curbing needed to be
maintained in certain areas for water quality and the other thing was that there were whimsical
ball elements that acted as bollards. The area in the original drawings had no zero curbing; Staff
felt that the suggestions were that both sides could be more free-form and one of the issues was
the concern for safety and they had not wanted it to be too free-form. The drivers entering that
site, while they needed to be calmed down, were more likely to be a little frantic and they wanted
to focus and channel where pedestrians would make the links. The attempt was to combine
ADA requirements as well as the traffic issues.
Chair McCormack stated he had brought that up initially and he had looked at it as an area he
pointed to on the drawings being one flat plane and there would be a little bit of 2% slope that
would go away for drainage. There was a 6" curb face and he questioned the civil engineer in
how he would go from a zero curb to a ramp to the platform.
Ms. Fox stated there was that detail on the grading plans. She explained how the transitional
ramping would work and pointed out those details on the plans.
Chair McCormack stated the numbers had not made sense, in a case where that situation
normally occurred to get one flat area; it would remain 2% and not transition from zero to 6".
Ms. Fox stated she believed they were going to bring it back up.
Mr. Talarico stated he would be happy to look at that and revise the numbers.
Ms. Fox stated the plan was taken from the landscape plan and not the grading plan and she
would double check the numbers.
Chair McCormack stated he understood what the attempt was and it looked perfect.
Mr. Talarico stated the overall effect would be what had been suggested and he pointed out
additional details, such as lighting, on the plans.
Committee Member Wheeler stated on the element that had been canted out, he suggested
sloping the top of the other side.
Ms. Fox stated it was the scale of the drawing and it had been sloped.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to receive and file DRC No. 4209-07, CHOC
Master Plan (response to project conditions).
SECOND: Adrienne Gladson
APES: Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 4 of 16
AGENDA ITEMS:
Items To Be Continued To A Future Date:
3) DRC No. 4340-08 - WAHOO'S FISH TACOS
To be continued to the next DRC meeting of August 19, 2009
A proposal to demolish anon-contributing one-story facade addition, the subsequent
rehabilitation of the two-story Vineland Hotel building including construction of a new
in-fill, two-story office/retail addition.
222-228 W. Chapman Avenue, Plaza Historic District
Staff Contact: Dan Ryan, 714-744-7224, dr.~nae,cityoforangeorg
Preliminary Review from the July 2, 2008 DRC meeting
DRC Action: Recommendation to the Planning Commission
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to continue DRC No. 4340-08, Wahoo's Fish
Tacos, to a date certain of August 19, 2009.
SECOND: Adrienne Gladson
AYES: Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 5 of 16
Continued Items:
4) DRC No. 4297-07 -MAIN MEDICAL PLAZA
A proposal to construct a new 7,981 square foot two-story medical office building with
one level of underground parking.
396 S. Main Street
Staff Contact: Sonal Thakur, 714-744-7239, sthakur(a,cityoforan~,e.org
Continued from the DRC meeting of June 17, 2009
DRC Action: Final Determination
Assistant Planner, Sonal Thakur, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Bruce Manzer, address on file, stated he had nothing additional to add.
Public Comment
None.
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he felt what they had done had come off very well.
Mr. Manzer stated he felt that way too; with the forms and colors it worked well.
Committee Member Wheeler stated the design worked well. He pointed to an area on the plan
and asked what the area was?
Mr. Manzer stated it was a trash enclosure.
Committee Member Wheeler stated most of his comments centered around the roof plan and
how it related to the elevations. First of all, if they reviewed the building in one manner, the
upper parapet should have a gap and it was shown as continuous and that needed to be resolved.
He thought there was a problem on a plane, he pointed to it on the drawings, there was a wide
pilaster on the floor plans and on the other set it was a wider pilaster. He reviewed the plans
with the applicant and pointed out the inconsistencies. He suggested to overlay the floor plans to
verify what was occurring, and also for the roof plan. There appeared to be a parapet return and
on the lower element it had not shown that return. He suggested that if the item was approved
that a condition could be added that Staff and one member of the Committee review the drawings
to verify those items had been cleaned up. He asked if that was appropriate?
Ms. Aranda Roseberry stated she was not certain that it was. If there was something specific the
item could return to an Administrative Session. She would verify with the City Attorney and see
what they could come up with.
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Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 6 of 16
Chair McCormack stated there was a zero curb that occurred in two spots. In another area what
was proposed was a wheel stop, and what he suggested to clean the area up a bit, would be to
depress the curb in that zone. He pointed those areas out on the drawings. He stated there was a
good example of that at the Orange Public Library.
Mr. Manzer stated, in an area he pointed to on the plans, was the loading zone for the trash
enclosure and they had felt that the change in elevations would be more of a trip hazard, but the
wheel stops were also a trip hazard. He understood the suggestion and it would be cleaner.
Chair McCormack stated on the landscape, he suggested the Palm trees be at least 10' brown
trunk and the trees to be 24" box. The plant material variety types had not been noted. He
suggested using the Indian tribe variety of Crape Myrtle and on the Rhaphiolepis indica, the type
had not been indicated and he suggested using white. Yellow and pink would not go well in
landscaping the site. With bumping up the Palm tree, the only 24" box would be the Magnolia
tree. He asked for clarification on what was planted in an area of the plans? He suggested
continuing the grasses in that area. He had the same type of grass in his yard and it was
consistently red brown and for most people it would appear dead. When it was planted people
would think the applicant had planted dead grass, left alone it would appear as a panel of dead
grass. He would plant it 30" on center rather than 36" and planted in mass with the area being
used as a swale. He suggested using sage in areas he pointed to on the plans and to move the
Palm trees out of the swale flow line. Plant the Jacksprat flax 12" on center.
Mr. Manzer presented examples of the lighting they intended to use. It was a wall sconce and it
would be in green.
Committee Member Gladson asked if the applicant had explored the roof load situation?
Mr. Manzer stated yes, they would over design it to accommodate the load.
Chair McCormack stated he had made a previous comment that they should use real soil not
lightweight soil, as that would volatize and turn to gas; it actually disappeared. It was important
to ensure that the engineer designed for real soil on the project.
Chair McCormack made a motion to approve DRC No. 4297-07, Main Medical Plaza, with the
conditions contained in the Staff Report and with the additional comments presented by
Committee Member Wheeler for the plan corrections and the suggestions stated by Chair
McCormack on the soil and planting issues.
SECOND: Adrienne Gladson
AYES: Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 7 of 16
New Agenda Items:
5) DRC No. 4258-07 - RODRIGUEZ RESIDENCE
A proposal for revisions to a previous DRC approval to construct a 2,079 square foot
two-story second dwelling unit with an attached two-car garage.
4224 E. Washington Avenue
Staff Contact: Chad Ortlieb, 714-744-7237, cortlieb ,cityoforange~org
DRC Action: Final Determination
Senior Planner, Chad Ortlieb, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Ismael Inda, address on file, stated the unfortunate part of the project was that they
had done the project and the roof pitch was now too high. He had followed all the guides at 4'
and 12', unfortunately somehow and someway they had gotten an approved set of plans that was
different than Planning had received, and in checking the elevations they had not matched.
Based on that they had 9' ceilings on both levels and that presented a roof height discrepancy.
On the front portion of the property the change had been done due to the span and if continuing
the 4' and 12' it would have covered the windows. He felt the drafter at the time had intended to
do it straight. When they were looking at the front porch and it had fit nice and tight, with the
garage as well.
Public Comment
None.
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion.
Committee Member Gladson asked if it had been a practice for the applicant that the field set of
plans had not matched what was on file with Planning?
Mr. Inda stated no. They had followed the stamped copy and the building inspector caught it.
Committee Member Wheeler stated just to show what a difference it had made, on the original
drawings it had been approximately 22' high and now it was 26' which was a big difference and
it had come about due to number changes. There had been a 9' ceiling on the downstairs portion
and now there was a 9' ceiling upstairs. The plate was being clipped down and he could not
imagine that had been done and footage had been gained there. There was an odd situation
where they had gone to a raised floor and the applicant probably discovered problems with it.
The raised floor had been level with the garage slab and that was not done; what it meant was
around the perimeter of the garage it was 6" to grade, but around the house it was about 1 ''/z' to
grade. That added more height and created a problem of how to get to that raised floor, The
front porch had been changed to a raised porch and there would need to be steps there. There
would also need to be steps to the garage which might not be appropriate, if it encroached into
the garage space and they would need to verify with Staff on those components. He was
concerned with the garage space and the addition of a stoop might not make the garage legal.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 8 of 16
The hip roof was okay and had not represented a problem. It was really a big difference from
what had been approved.
Committee Member Gladson stated it was not a situation that they would want to see repeated in
the City. She assumed the maximum height in the area was higher than 26' and it was within the
code. There were certainly other tall two-story structures in that neighborhood and it would
generally comply. It was different and appeared different than what they approved.
Committee Member Wheeler stated they had a precedent, when Chapman had built the film
school they realized that the mechanical equipment was much higher than presented and the
partial solution was that they added more landscape. They added landscape to surrounding
homes to block their view and he asked Chair McCormack if there was something with the use
of landscape that would soften the building?
Chair McCormack stated they could definitely do that. He had a question regarding the shear
walls and asked the applicant to review that with him. He asked if there would be grading and
how the elevation problem would be solved?
Mr. Inda stated it had been solved. There was a minimum clearance of 4" and on the outside it
was 6" at a 2% grade, the lot drainage was backwards and he had corrected that. They would be
adding additional drainage, but not above the sill.
Chair McCormack stated there was a lot of exposed footing and landscape could hide a lot of
that.
Committee Member Wheeler suggested for a trade off of the increase in height could the
Committee ask for a few more trees to be planted?
Chair McCormack stated he was not certain they could even ask for a landscape plan.
Ms. Aranda Roseberry stated typically they would not, however, the project was not in
substantial conformance with what had been approved and that was why it was before them. The
DRC needed to weigh the pros and cons in a solution. One of the options would be to tear down
and redo, and the other option would be to make the project better. To suggest something that
would bring the height down and that was something that could be conditioned. Staff's thoughts
were that there could be landscape additions, architectural trims that could visually bring the
height down, or things of that nature. They could condition the landscape as a trade-off.
Chair McCormack stated there was a project on Tustin at Santiago Creek with athree-story
apartment complex and it had been suggested that the eaves be extended to bring the height
down a bit.
Committee Member Wheeler stated structurally it would be difficult to require on the project
currently. It would have a lowering effect and if the project had been built to plan with a clipped
ceiling it would have done the same thing. It would be a lot to ask for the eaves to be projected
based on where the applicant was in the project.
Chair McCormack and Committee Member Wheeler reviewed the plans.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 9 of 16
Chair McCormack stated obviously landscape could solve the problem. There was not a
landscape plan and he had some suggestions. He referred to the plans and he had thought there
was a condition regarding backing up and getting into an area he pointed to on the plans. He
asked if the concrete was being brought all the way back?
Committee Member Wheeler stated he wondered if they could ask for "X" number of trees with
a specific size to be planted.
Chair McCormack stated it would need to be designed and there would need to be a plan.
Committee Member Gladson stated the corner would be an area that they could soften as that
would be an area that would be visible from Washington. There was a 9' setback and possibly
that would be an area that trees could be planted in.
The Committee Members reviewed the plans and pointed out areas where trees could be planted.
Committee Member Gladson stated, as it was a second unit addition, there was the potential for
income on the property and she felt the applicant should put a formal landscape plan together and
come up with a design pattern to soften everything.
Chair McCormack stated they were spending a lot of money on the building and he asked would
the applicant not want to integrate an exterior plan that would design the rest of the lot?
Ms. Aranda Roseberry stated given the situation she felt the suggestion was reasonable. They
were attempting to find a way to mitigate the impact of the higher building from what had been
approved. If that was the direction the DRC would be moving toward, a condition could be
made with indication that the applicant could continue to build and move forward on the project
with a landscape plan to return for review.
Committee Member Gladson asked if Staff felt they had a very clear set of plans that depicted
everything that was occurring in the field?
Mr. Ortlieb stated Staff was recommending a condition that would cover that.
Chair McCormack stated if they were to condition that a landscape plan be developed and to
have that return for review that it should be on an accurate plan that showed what existed and
what was proposed. A layer that was screened back with the existing and bolder notations with
what was proposed.
Committee Member Wheeler suggested the stoops and stairs to get to the raised floor could also
be shown on those plans. If the garage had not worked, one solution would be to seal off the
door between the house and the door. That would be up to Planning to decide if it worked.
Committee Member Gladson asked with raised floors would there be additional plantings
required along that edge?
Committee Member Wheeler stated the siding would be brought down with only 6" to 8"
exposed with a transition between the garage and house.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 10 of 16
Chair McCormack stated the entry might need to be moved; he reviewed the plans and
measurements with Committee Member Wheeler and discussed the wall and step placements.
With the landscape plan the Committee would want to see where steps and concrete would be, it
would be the entire site plan.
Committee Member Wheeler stated it would also be helpful if the rough grade was shown
relative to the floor elevations.
Chair McCormack stated the applicant would need to consider drainage with water coming off
the roof; they would need to solve that problem.
Committee Member Wheeler suggested looking at three trees in the back with another on the
side.
Committee Member Gladson asked Chair McCormack if he had any suggestions for the species
of trees the applicant might use?
Chair McCormack suggested the use of a tree that was more vertical than conical, a more
pyramidical shaped tree species.
Mr. Ortlieb stated for clarification there was an area, which he pointed to on the plans, that
would be used for required parking; any trees that would go in that area would be in a 4' area.
Staff had not placed a condition of approval for revised plans and building plan check which
would need to be done.
Chair McCormack read from Item No.6: prior to building permit issuance the plans shall show
that tall fescue-type turf as opposed to Kentucky Blue grass, and all lawn areas shall be sod. The
whole area appeared to be sod and there should be an irrigation plan. He stated the applicant
would not want to plant all that sod without installing an irrigation system. They needed to have
an irrigation plan.
Chair McCormack made a motion to approve DRC No. 4258-07, Rodriguez Residence, subject
to the conditions contained in the Staff Report and with the following additional conditions:
1. To have a landscape plan developed and submitted; and to allow construction to continue.
2. To have screening with a minimum of four trees.
3. A clean set of building plans shall be submitted with what existed at the site.
SECOND: Adrienne Gladson
AYES:Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES:None
ABSTAIN:None
ABSENT:Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 11 of 16
6) DRC No. 4425-09 - LUCILLE'S RIB SHACK
A proposal to renovate the existing Hofs Hut in order to re-brand the restaurant to a
Lucille's Rib Shack.
4050 W. Chapman Avenue
Staff Contact: Doris Nguyen, 714-744-7223, dnguyen(a,cityoforange.org
DRC Action: Final Determination
Associate Planner, Doris Nguyen, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Craig Oka, address on file, stated he was the architect on the project. Ms. Nguyen
had done an excellent job in the Staff Report and they had gone back and forth to add an
equipment screen. It was a new venture for Lucille's and there was a need for it. Patrons would
order at the counter, select their table, and food would be brought to them. The same quality
food would be provided with a little less service.
Applicant, Paul Williamson, address on file, stated he had nothing additional to add.
Public Comment
None.
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion.
Committee Member Wheeler stated a smoker was added and asked if that would require venting
that would be visible?
Mr. Oka stated no, it would have an exhaust hood above it and there would be an exhaust fan in
the equipment well that would be fully screened.
Committee Member Wheeler stated there was additional screening on top of the parapet and he
asked what it would be screening?
Mr. Oka stated there was existing equipment that it would screen and they would be redoing the
electrical panels and that would be screened as well.
Committee Member Wheeler stated it might be less bothersome to eliminate the screen and just
paint the swamp cooler light blue to have it go away a bit and not need the foreign element on
top of the roof.
Ms. Nguyen stated there was other equipment that was being added and because of the interior
T.I. it was slightly above the parapet. The screening was added based on the code requirements
that all mechanical equipment would be screened. She read from the code.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he was a bit prejudiced about that, as the code had not
applied to City Hall, as there were two ugly pieces of visible equipment at City Hall.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 12 of 16
Chair McCormack stated the existing glass remained and they would be adding new lights.
There was a post base on one side and he suggested adding the same type of post base to the
other side.
Mr. Oka stated those would be on the existing pilasters and they would be short.
Chair McCormack asked if the fabric awning was being replaced?
Mr. Oka stated yes, that would be replaced and they would use the existing frame.
Chair McCormack suggested that they match the base and the pole with the same vocabulary.
To paint them the same might just dress them up a bit.
Mr. Oka presented a color board to the Committee.
Committee Member Gladson stated the top of the chimney had an existing metal element and it
could be a nice tie-in to the metal element on the parapet. She liked the metal.
Ms. Nguyen asked if the DRC wanted the parapet to match the wall color.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he liked how it was presented.
Chair McCormack stated the picnic tables were shown in white and there were no other white
features on the building. White showed a lot of wear. They had black elements, and suggested
they could possibly paint the picnic tables to match. The concrete would be gray and he was
thinking out loud and pointed to different elements that could be black to upgrade things just
with a color change.
Mr. Williamson stated he was not certain that the tables were wood. He had not seen that sample
and he would want Polywood or a similar material, not a painted item. Lazy Dog used the same
types of table and they would want the same which he believed came in different colors.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to approve DRC No. 4425-09, Lucille's Rib Shack,
subject to the conditions in the Staff Report.
SECOND: Tim McCormack
AYES: Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 13 of 16
7) DRC No. 4428-09 -KHAN RESIDENCE
A proposal to demolish 1,047 square feet of the existing main house and add 6,011 square
feet, add a fourth garage space, and an arcade leading to a 900 square foot second-story
above the garage for a theater.
7630 E. Santiago Canyon Road
Staff Contact: Doris Nguyen, 714-744-7223, do uyen ,ci oforange.or~
DRC Action: Final Determination
Associate Planner, Doris Nguyen, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Lane Curtis, address on file, stated he was fine with all the conditions. The site would
not be changed, just changes to the house.
Applicant, Amir Khan, address on file, stated he had nothing further to add.
Public Comment
None.
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he would be interested in the history of the property.
Mr. Khan stated there was a house adjacent to the site and the previous owner had built the site
as an entertainment site. The house was not for living, but more of a party house. There was a
huge backyard and the home was a 1940's house without AC or proper heating. It was good
entertainment for the kids.
Committee Member Wheeler suggested it could be worthwhile to have photo documentation
with awrite-up about the property to be filed with the Orange Public Library.
Ms. Nguyen stated it was a very fascinating house and it was hard to describe everything that
was there.
Mr. Khan stated they would be leaving the exterior areas the way they were and only changing
the house to make it livable.
Committee Member Gladson stated photo documentation was what she would also suggest.
With Orange Park Acres there was an eclectic environment and she concurred with the edginess
of the home and she was a bit saddened to see it go. She had no idea that home existed.
Documenting the property would be very valuable. She asked about the mixing of styles?
Mr. Curtis stated he wanted to clarify that they would be altering the house per the plans and
leaving the site intact. They would attempt to integrate some of the materials such as stone.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 14 of 16
Mr. Khan stated they would only be changing the house and the exterior sites would be left
alone.
Mr. Curtis stated Mr. Khan's brother had purchased the home next door and it would be a kid
compound for a while.
Committee Member Gladson stated she was concerned that they were mixing the two.
Mr. Khan stated the exterior elements were far away from the home and it would not take away
from that.
Chair McCormack asked for clarification on an element he pointed to on the plans?
Ms. Nguyen stated that was the pool with a water fall and a water wheel. There was a spinning
water wheel that led into a slide to the spa.
Mr. Curtis stated most of the site had been developed in just the last five years and it was not
historical. The house had been there since 1942 and the large lawn area had been an arena. The
out-structures and the chapel were very recent additions. There was a mural on the side of the
house. The fellow was developing the site as his dream house; it had been sold unfortunately
through a divorce.
Committee Member Wheeler stated on the roof plan there was an element that needed to be
added to the other floor. The existing roof was shown as quite a bit lower on the elevation.
There was a fireplace in the retreat and asked if it was just a gas appliance?
Mr. Curtis stated yes it was.
Committee Member Wheeler suggested that he might want to look at that belly band, with one
possibility being to change the profile of it, as it showed differently on the garage or to just get
rid of it, it was his call. He reviewed the plans with Mr. Curtis. He thought the design worked
fine as long as they were not required to state it was totally compatible with the neighborhood.
He felt the proposed project worked very well. One additional point was the arch; he felt it was
too thin and a horizontal beam might work better.
Chair McCormack asked on the area that connected the second level to the new garage how that
worked?
Mr. Curtis stated it was a covered walkway and he had not wanted to add anymore detail to take
away from the house.
Ms. Nguyen stated it was the only access into the theater as there was no first floor access.
Mr. Curtis stated the area above the garage was a theater with a wet bar and he had intended to
keep it minimal.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 15 of 16
Mr. Khan stated the kids kept coming up with ideas for the house.
Committee Member Wheeler asked if the applicant would keep the gates with the cowboys on
top?
Mr. Khan stated they probably would keep those; the gates had not currently worked.
Mr. Curtis stated there would eventually be changes to the site.
Committee Member Gladson suggested, to elaborate on what Committee Member Wheeler had
brought up earlier with the photo documentation, that a narrative effort be made with the
possibility of getting assistance from a historical expert from the neighborhood. The folks in the
Orange Park Acres Association might assist him, to document the portion of the house that
would go away and to capture what had been there.
Mr. Khan stated he understood about the history, however, the previous owner had completed
much of the site, and it was recent and not historical. The site was not historical.
Committee Member Gladson stated she was suggesting an oral interview to literally understand
what the pervious owner had envisioned.
Committee Member Wheeler stated it could be a recommendation.
Mr. Khan stated he felt there had already been documentation on a T.V. show and possibly he
could get a copy of that documentation.
Mr. Curtis stated the previous owner was going through a difficult time and at a later date they
might be able to obtain that.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to approve DRC No. 4428-09, Khan Residence,
subject to the conditions contained in the Staff Report and with the following suggestion:
1. To gather photo and written documentation of the home to be presented to the Orange
Public Library.
SECOND: Adrienne Gladson
AYES: Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTIOI~T CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for August 5, 2009
Page 16 of 16
ADJOURNMENT:
Committee Member Gladson made a motion to adjourn to the next regular scheduled meeting on
August 19, 2009 at 5:00 p.m. The meeting adjourned at 7:08 p.m.
SECOND: Craig Wheeler
AYES: Adrienne Gladson, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Bill Cathcart and Joe Woollett
MOTION CARRIED.