04-03-2002 DRC MinutesCITY OF ORANGE
DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE
MINUTES
Wednesday, April 3, 2002
Committee Members Present: Mark Paone
Karen Sully*
Joe Woollett (Chair)
For Alice Angus)
Staff in Attendance: Chuck Lau, Associate Planner
Howard Morris, Landscape Coordinator
Madeline Russell, Recording Secretary
Committee Member Absent: Alice Angus
Leonard Filner (Vice Chair)
Susan Secoy
Administrative Session - 4:30 P.M.
The committee met for an administrative session beginning at 4:30 p.m. The meeting adjourned
at approximately 8:15 p.m.
Regular Session - 5:30 PM
REVIEW OF MINUTES:
Review and approval of the meeting minutes was continued to the April 17, 2002 meeting.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 2
DRC No. 3636 - EDMONDS RESIDENCE
New retaining wall and revised landscape plans for a custom residence at Prospect
Hills (Tract 13913 -Lot 15).
461 Carlisle Place
Staff Contact: Chuck Lau -Associate Planner
DRC Action: Final Determination
Bill Cathcart, Architect, Cathcart-Begin Associates
Requesting approval of a 4-'/2 ft. retaining wall to allow owner more hill top footage.
The plan shows the addition of plant material for fuel modification. Applicant is not
requesting approval of the fuel modification tonight. This portion will be presented to the
Design Review Committee at a later time, after the Home Owners Association has
completed its evaluation.
The Fire Department has already approved the plan and the plant material being added,
Acacia in 1-gallon containers, is on the Fire Department's fuel modification list.
The Fire Department realizes that an additional fuel modification has to be done in
consideration of other lots in proximity, the George Adams' house, the B-zone and around
the corner. That will be another submittal.
Two types of materials on the wall. In front of the wall will be Acacia, Blue Hibiscus, and
Bougainvillea, so that when you look up from below you can't see the wall. On lower
levels planting would feather out based on height of the walls.
Acacia is native to Australia and grows in a similar climate as ours. It provides billows of
plant material to cover the hillside. It is a soil binder and is fire retardant.
Committee Member viewed the proposed plan as a radical concept, a different thought, in
effect, to raise the whole hill up five or six ft. with plants.
The plant material in Fuel Modification C is a combination of native plants.
The Acacia blooms early spring through early summer and the color will blend in.
Planting would occur at six-foot intervals so they don't grow too thick and high. Four to
eight feet is acceptable.
The Fire Department requires distinct delineations between Zone B and Zone C so the
HOAs can keep the particular areas in good condition. Markers tell the difference between
Zone B and Zone C irrigation systems, the functionality is determined by each separate
irrigation system.
The architect is negotiating with George Adams to redo the fuel modification around his
property. Additionally, if support is forthcoming from the Homeowners Association,
possibly redo the remaining houses and continue this plan to parts that have been
disturbed by the grading.
Committee Members applauded attempt to find a solution for all, probably should have
been done when the first plan came before the DRC.
The plan is not obstructing any long views, not changing the grading of the slope, and the
plant material just continues down the slope.
Committee Members indicated concern for wall exceeding 2-'/z ft. wall, which is what has
been approved in the past. There is not enough information concerning the whole area.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 3
DRC No. 3636 - EDMONDS RESIDENCE (Continued)
Committee Members expressed a need for continuation drawings for the whole hill. The
architect does not have any other contracts yet, but is attempting to build a process, and
get the HOA to buy into the approach to enhance the whole area.
Approval of this plan encourages the Homeowners Association to adopt the plan
throughout; it gives them the impetus to make the appropriate recommendation.
Committee Member indicated the need for a lower transitional plant where there is no wall.
Edmond owns the property to the bottom of the hill. The owner pays for installation only
and the HOA maintains the entire slope thereafter.
Applicant asking for approval so a structural engineer can be hired to build the wall. In the
interim, will begin the process of creating a planting plan for the house, as well as,
additions to Zone B, because planting will take place about the same time. Edmonds
would like to be in the house in October.
The neighbors in adjacent houses have to comply with what is approved when they come
before the DRC.
Committee Member ascertained the expected rate of growth for the Acacia is medium to
fast, 2-ft. per year; it begins by growing horizontally and then grows outward toward the
sun.
PUBLIC COMMENT: None
A motion was made by Committee Member Mark Paone to recommend approval of the project
with the following conditions:
1. Spacing on the Acacias shall be minimum six feet, maximum eight feet.
2. Applicant is to return to DRC with an additional plant material of lower height, for the
transitional areas on adjoining properties.
SECOND: Joe Woollett
AYES: Mark Paone, Karen Sully, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Alice Angus, Leonard Filner, Susan Secoy
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 4
2. DRC No. 3713 -CHRIS KENT
Expansion of an entry area and addition of a 162 sq. ft. bathroom and closet for an
existing residence. Project also includes the demolition of an existing detached garage,
and the construction of a new 2-car detached garage.
367 S. Clark Street (Old Towne Historic District))
Staff Contact: Daniel Ryan -Senior Planner, Historic Preservation
DRC Action: Final Determination
Continued from 03-20-02 meeting)
Chris Kent, Owner, and Brad Smith, Architect
Adding a bathroom and closet, moving the front door out a few feet, minor adjustments to
the inside, and removing the existing garage to construct a new 2-car detached garage.
Committee Members inquired whether applicant had reviewed the Staff Report
recommendations. Applicant indicated they had not received the document and were
given copies to review as the conditions were read.
Noted some of the existing windows on the front face of the house aren't wood. Over the
years, they were replaced in an "ad hoc" manner. There is a mixed bag of window types.
The existing protruding bay window in the back is vinyl, and applicant wants to relocate on
center with the wall.
Committee Members ascertained that possibly 6 of 15 windows are not wood, and of the
existing wood windows three are double hung wood with wood sash. Three windows are
sliding windows of vinyl or steel casement.
The goal is to match the existing windows in profile and color, be it real wood or vinyl.
Applicant suggested it might be a good idea to flip the toilet and shower to allow a longer
proportion of window on that exterior wall compared to the small window that exists.
Committee Members expressed need to be as consistent as possible across each
elevation.
PUBLIC COMMENT: None
A motion was made by Committee Member Mark Paone to approve the project with the
following conditions:
1. All new windows shall be the same type, design and material as the existing wood
windows.
2. New exterior stucco finish on the garage and new additions shall match the existing stucco
finish of the residence.
3. Sectional roll-up door and man door on the garage may be made of alternate material,
have a "wood-look" and a panel design.
4. Roofing material shall match existing in color, profile and material
5. The windows to the north shall be new double hung windows to match the existing
windows; the window to the east shall be a 5-ft. window of appropriate style, if the
applicant chooses to relocate it.
6. The two windows in the restroom shall be of identical size and design.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 5
2. DRC No. 3713 -CHRIS KENT (Continued)
SECOND:
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
ABSTAINED
Joe Woollett
Mark Paone, Karen Sully, Joe Woollett
None
Alice Angus, Leonard Filner, Susan Secoy
None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 6
3. DRC No. 3712 -METRO COURT
Replacement freestanding directory sign for an existing commercial complex.
428-622 W. Katella Avenue
Staff Contact: Chuck Lau -Associate Planner
DRC Action: Final Determination
Approved as Consent Item)
A motion was made by Committee Chair Joe Woollett to approve the project as submitted.
SECOND: Mark Paone
AYES: Mark Paone, Karen Sully, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Alice Angus, Leonard Filner, Susan Secoy
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 7
4. DRC No. 3715 -SPIRIT OF AMERICA TOURS & TRAVEL
New bus dispatch facility on a vacant lot to consist of parking lot and landscape
improvements, and the use of move-on modular structures for administrative office and
caretaker's unit.
1065 N. Batavia Street
Staff Contact: Christopher Carnes -Senior Planner
DRC Action: Final Determination
Dave Brown and Ken Lycett.
Committee Member asked for clarification on the caretaker's unit and whether there were
residential requirements. Senior Staff responded that a caretaker residence is zoned
differently from asingle-family residence, there is a restriction of one person occupancy
and there is no requirement to provide a garage nor are there landscape requirements. It
is treated as an industrial building.
There will be hard gravel sealed area for parking with asphalt paving up front; there will be
a car port for the resident; the dispatch facility will sit on concrete slab the same size as
the facility.
Talked to neighbors, Select Construction, about putting up some sort of concrete wall on
the property line. There is an existing chain link fence with shrubbery.
There will be concrete drainage against the fence to the south or southwest. Already
submitted grading plan,
Mobil home will have a front and back door and a small porch with steps at the end.
Committee Member ascertained that a dumpster, behind the office, will be on site for
trash.
Committee Member inquired whether applicants had reviewed Staff Report. Applicants
affirmed their review.
Committee Member pointed out that a concern related to the use of gravel, which is not to
code and would like to see some ground cover. Applicant responded that there would be
no gravel and would use low maintenance ground cover.
Committee Member indicated that final irrigation plan must be submitted prior to issuance
of building permit.
Committee Member highlighted the need for better, more accurate documentation since a
lot of changes have been discussed, i.e. the dumpster, turning radius, exterior view of
trailer(s), ground cover, elevations, materials, colors, etc.
Applicant was given a list of requirements for the next submittal.
A motion was made by Committee Member Mark Paone to continue the project for additional
information and refinement of site details.
SECOND:Karen Sully
AYES:Mark Paone, Karen Sully, Joe Woollett
NOES:None
ABSENT:Alice Angus, Leonard Filner, Susan Secoy
ABSTAINED:None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 8
5. DRC No. 3717 -FIRST SOUTHWESTERN TITLE
New tenant wall sign for an existing commercial office building.
2100 W. Orangewood Avenue, Suite 180
Staff Contact: Chuck Lau -Associate Planner
DRC Action: Final Determination
Approved as Consent Item)
A motion was made by Committee Chair Joe Woollett to approve the project as submitted.
SECOND: Mark Paone
AYES: Mark Paone, Karen Sully, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Alice Angus, Leonard Filner, Susan Secoy
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 9
6. DRC No. 3718 -CITY OF ORANGE MAIN LIBRARY EXPANSION PROJECT
Review of design considerations (conceptual site plan and building elevations) for the
proposed 28,000 sq. ft. expansion to the existing 17,000 sq. ft. main library facility.
101 N. Center Street (Old Towne Historic District)
Staff Contact: Christopher Carnes -Senior Planner
DRC Action: Recommendation to Planning Commission
Nora Jacob, City Librarian, and James T. Wirick, Principal of LPA Architects and staff were
present.
The City Librarian wanted to affirm key points heard at the joint meeting of the City Council,
the Planning Commission, and the Design Review Committee, on April 2, 2002:
o Encouraged to look at a smaller entryway and using more decorative elements.
o No skylight or amuch-reduced skylight.
o Include the tower, relocated to the Chapman Avenue side, away from the residential side
of the building and closer to the street side.
o To develop more visual interest for the east side of the building.
o To consider anorth/south entrance/access.
o To consider some kind of glass connection between the two buildings pieces, the new
and the old.
o To break the rhythm of the arcade along Chapman Avenue and give the arcade a
function, if it exists at all.
The City Librarian wanted to review architectural details:
o The City Council voted to endorse the Spanish Colonial Revival style design.
o How to incorporate some of these details into Spanish Colonial Revival and create the
basis of tonight's discussion.
o Pursue the flat roof option as shown in "Scenario A".
Committee Member noted that the comments enumerated were made at different times so
they don't necessarily apply to all scenarios. There was also a comment about the location
of the entrance and how far patrons had to walk -the concern was to have only one
entrance to avoid doubling staff or possibly having two entrances, one on the north and one
on the south.
The architects indicated these ideas are being explored. There could be a postcard entrance
on the south face, aligned with Center Street, and a functional one on the north face, if the
geometries work out.
Committee Member indicated
o The comments made about the glass connections seemed to be a "what if° scenario,
which may not fit.
o An interesting elevation would be to detach the arcade to show details with and without
the arcade, possibly revealing some relationships for further definition.
o Concerned about the length and repetition of the arcade.
o Concerned about the need to look at the punched windows at both high and low
elevations -the band of windows on the bottom seem to resemble a "store front".
The architects expressed the desire to interpret the Spanish Colonial Revival style in the
context of Orange City.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for April 3, 2002
Page 10
6. DRC No. 3718 - CITY OF ORANGE MAIN LIBRARY EXPANSION PROJECT (Continued
Committee Member suggested a look at two recent approvals -All Faiths Chapel and St.
John's Lutheran Church.
The architect stated the effort is to resist having the head of the ballerina, the body of the
hippopotamus, and the feet of the truck driver. The flat roof is compelling in that it is
arguably the least expensive of the three scenarios.
The architect suggested there is a balance between rubber stamping it and abstracting it too
much and maintaining the building's integrity.
Committee Member indicated skylights relate to the "green building" idea, which is very
popular.
Committee Member suggested that as currently proposed the front door faces the plaza
where there is such a pedestrian dynamic going which the library should benefit from.
The Librarian stated concerns for use of the interior spaces and how it flows with the
western entrance.
The architects alluded to the east elevation and how it exposes the Edwards House. The
parking is nosed right up to the building. The east face is a big challenge.
Committee Member expressed confidence in LPA, who stated their concern for whether
they are proceeding in the right direction.
PUBLIC COMMENT: Jeff Frankel, O.T.P.A., agreed that the flat roof is probably the best and
most palatable design for the O.T.P.A. members.
A motion was made by Committee Member Mark Paone to continue the project to the April 17,
2002 meeting wherein the committee will consider the revised plans.
SECOND: Joe Woollett
AYES: Mark Paone, Karen Sully, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSENT: Alice Angus, Leonard Filner, Susan Secoy
ABSTAINED: None
MOTION CARRIED
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