11-13-2013 - Minutes TCCITY OF ORANGE
CITY TRAFFIC COMMISSION
Minutes of a Regular Meeting: November 13, 2013
I. OPENING
A. Flag Pledge
B. Roll Call
Present - Commissioners: E. Glasgow, W. King, M. Lebeau, C. Vaughan
Absent - Commissioners: J. Beil
Present - Staff: A. Farahani, D. Allenbach, D. Hoard, Sgt. J. Bird, P. Then
C. Approval of Minutes
• October 9, 2013
ACTION: Approved as published by the Recording Secretary.
MOTION:
SECOND:
AYES:
NOES:
ABSTAIN:
Glasgow
King
Unanimous
None
None
II. ORAL PRESENTATIONS
None this month.
III. CONSENT CALENDAR
None this month.
g City of
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Public Works Department
Tape #CTC -33.06 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
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IV. CONSIDERATION ITEMS
1. Request for the installation of red curb markings on both sides of the two
driveways serving 1426 -1450 W. Collins Ave.
Bob Kirkeby
Furniture Traditions
1450 W. Collins Ave.
Orange, CA 92867 -5477
Oral presentation is based on the written staff report; please refer to your copy. Vice
Chairman Vaughan opened the public hearing for the following discussion:
Commissioner King - What are the east and west cross - streets?
Dave Allenbach, Transportation Analyst — The major cross - streets are Main St.
and Eckhoff St. The closest area would be Elm St. which is about 100 ft. west of
the subject area.
Commissioner Glasgow — I was out there this morning at 1429 right across the
street and I drove in and out of there and I didn't notice any line -of -sight issues.
ACTION Denied the request.
ACTION: Glasgow
SECOND: King
AYES: Unanimous
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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2. Request for the installation of red curb markings for the easterly driveway at
17871 E. Collins Ave.
Georgy Hany
17871 Collins Ave.
Villa Park, CA 92861
Oral presentation is based on the written staff report, please refer to your copy. Vice
Chairman Vaughan opened the public hearing for the following discussion:
Vice Chairman Vaughan — Is there a high demand for parking on that side of the
street?
Dave Allenbach, Transportation Analyst — Parking has been removed from most
of Collins Ave. there is about 45 ft. within our City just to the east of the
proponent's easterly driveway where parking is allowed and in the City of Villa
Park parking is allowed to just about 200 ft. from Wanda, in front of about 3 -4
homes in that area. We have not seen anyone park in that area the many times
we have been out there.
Elvie Hawk, 17841 Collins Ave. — Villa Park — As I pull out of my property there
are about 10 cars on the left side before Morgan St. and Kathleen St. and I'm
always blindsided by these cars in Orange and I've almost hit somebody twice
already and it scares me to death. My property is a care home for the elderly and
sometimes I have passengers that I take to the hospital and I'm afraid somebody
will hit me. I would like to petition for red curb.
Vice Chairman Vaughan — You're saying that parking in the area affects your
line -of —sight at 17841 Collins Ave.
Elvie Hawk, 17841 Collins Ave. — Villa Park — Yes, right beside me there are
about 3 homes that are parking on the street with 10 or more cars.
Vice Chairman Vaughan closed the public hearing and returned the item to the
Commission for further discussion and a motion.
Amir Farahani, City Traffic Engineer — What Ms. Hawk is describing, she lives in
the City of Villa Park and I think she was talking about that segment that extends
from that point on to her residence.
g City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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ACTION Denied the request.
ACTION:
King
SECOND:
Glasgow
AYES:
Unanimous
NOES:
None
ABSTAIN:
None
Page 14
3. Request for the removal of red curb markings from the north side of the
driveway at 453 S. Orange St.
Tony Trabucco
450 S. Orange St.
Orange, CA 92866
Oral presentation is based on the written staff report, please refer to your copy.
Vice Chairman Vaughan - There was nobody parked there when I went by it
was hard for me to judge, can you get a normal size car there?
Dave Allenbach, Transportation Analyst - Its 14 ft. and that is not long enough
for a parking space for a car, if it were open for parking it would free space
between cars that are parked on the street. The demand for parking in the area is
just not that high.
Vice Chairman Vaughan opened the public hearing for the following discussion:
Angie Rust, 493 S. Grand St. - I took a walk over there the other day to find out
why there is a red curb in the middle of the block. The only place I could see a
possibility of why it was originally put in is because there is a fire hydrant across
the street. I came back to Grand St. and the fire hydrant curb has a red curb, but
I couldn't really understand why the red curb was put on Orange St. in August
of 2000 across the street from the fire hydrant. It's confusing why it was put
there originally and I can understand people wanting to have it removed.
Dave Allenbach, Transportation Analyst - We responded to a letter of request at
the time there were cars consistently parking next to his driveway and his
driveway is about 14 ft. wide. With any overhang at all there is definitely a
City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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problem for him to get in and out of his property. That was the basis for the
request, at the time we felt it had merit and accordingly we recommended it be
approved and the Traffic Commission supported that recommendation. Any
resident or business can make such a request to the City Traffic Commission and
the requests stand or fall on their own merit.
Tony Trabucco, 450 S. Orange St. — I am directly west and across the street from
the subject property. We do have a fire hydrant that is about 10 ft. inside my
property line. Unfortunately it showed up about a month after I purchased my
house so it pretty much eliminated a lot of parking in front of my house. Parking
has always been kind of restricted in the middle of the block. I would refute the
evening parking situation, during the day it's not a problem because everyone is
at work. When everyone gets home from work at around 8 -9 PM it tends to get
tight. There are a number of rental properties on the street, 413, 421 and 485
S. Orange St. have been converted into rentals, one has two units on the lot and
the other has college kids and Chapman University students that have just
moved in and they tend to have more vehicles per household, and many of the
tenants are parking in the prescribed parking for the 2 -hr. lots built a number of
years ago instead of their parking pads and garages and what have you. The
other issue I have is that I think this was originally approved as 10 ft. and as
mentioned it's been installed as 14 ft. for some reason so it does take up a little
more space that could be utilized during the heavy parking periods. When this
was originally put in parking wasn't as bad as it is now before we had the
additional rentals and what have you, and of course there was no public notice
given at that time so nobody was offered an opportunity to vote against it.
Charles Botzum, 453 S. Orange St. — If you will put up the photo of the where the
red curb is you will see that there is also a telephone pole and a tree around the
hedge which makes it, when you are pulling in or out of this driveway, if there is
a car parked there at all it is impossible to see any children or pedestrians coming
down the sidewalk, it is definitely a hazard. The only reason there is a parking
problem in the evening is that the 3 houses across the street all had their
driveways removed and have converted their garages into work sheds, etc. and
they don't want to park in the alley. So they want you to reverse the red curb,
risk people's lives. I leave the driveway in the daytime when all the little pre-
school kids are walking down to Hart Park, you cannot see them. I have lowered
the hedge in order to see them, I'm still lowering it. At night time this street is
poorly lit there is only 1 street light and believe it or not it's right there on the
power pole in front of my house but the tree has grown under it so you can't see
City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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anything and you could easily hit a pedestrian or someone's pet. But what this is
all about is that some people on the street want the red curb removed so they
don't have to put in a driveway or convert their garages back out of laziness and
they don't want to walk 4 houses down, they want to park either directly across
the street from their house or diagonally across, etc. This is all about risking
injury to people's lives and injury to public property in order for people to get as
close to their home as they can, and that is just not right.
Commissioner Lebeau — It's been mentioned that the original red curb was
approved at 10 ft. did you have any effort in maintaining it or extending it?
Dave Allenbach, Transportation Analyst — No sir, I never have. It was originally
approved when I came here in 2000 and I believe they issued it from 10 to 15 ft.
whatever the Traffic Commission decided, when they came out to paint he asked
me how big did I want it I can go between 10 -15 ft. and I answered the more the
merrier, its improving visibility and will be safer for children.
Vice Chairman Vaughan closed the public hearing and returned the item to the
Commission for further discussion and a motion.
ACTION: Move to remove 4 ft. that was not approved by the Traffic
Commission.
Motion dies for lack of Second.
Commissioner Lebeau - It's my concern that the extra footage was not approved
and because of that it shouldn't have been installed.
Commissioner Glasgow — Do you remember how the original recommendation
was made, was it 10 -15 ft. or was it specifically 10 ft. red curb?
Dave Allenbach, Transportation Analyst — At this time I can't really tell you, it
was 13 years ago. If it was approved for 10 ft. the work order would have gone
out saying 10 ft. but that additional 4 ft. covers the walkway here as shown in the
photograph. Any installed parking space is 20 ft. It was probably approved as
10 ft.
City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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Commissioner Glasgow — If you have blocked across the front of your house and
do you really want to walk by a hedge and into a vehicle to get off the curb. I can
understand why they want to go to the outside edge of the sidewalk and stop
there because you can park a vehicle right in the middle of his walkway.
Vice Chairman Vaughan — I gave great thought to all of the speakers but I know
human nature and one thing I know because a hedge is there when people are
allowed to park they do crazy things it is one the main reasons we get requests
for red curb. For whatever reason people with big trucks like to park as close as
they can to people's driveways and stick their tail -end into the driveway and if
that were my home that would be a big concern for me. I'd like to make a
motion to support staff's recommendation to deny the request and leave the red
curb in place.
Commissioner Lebeau — Is there any restriction as to the height of the greenery
that can be installed in the median like that?
Amir Farahani, City Traffic Engineer - Yes it is part of our Standard which is 12
inches high.
Commissioner Lebeau — Is that higher than 12 inches?
Amir Farahani, City Traffic Engineer — It looks much higher.
Commissioner Lebeau — Is that something that will be addressed?
Amir Farahani, City Traffic Engineer — If that is the direction from the
Commission yes.
Denah Hoard, Asst. City Engineer — That is an enforcement issue that should be
taken up with Code Enforcement.
ACTION: Denied the request and left the red curb in place.
MOTION: C. Vaughan
SECOND: M. Lebeau
AYES: Unanimous
` City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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3. Request for the installation of 20 minute time limit parking (green curb) in
front of 1910 N. Lime St.
Mark Fowler
Western Wall & Ceiling Contractors Assoc.
1910 N. Lime St.
Orange, CA 92865
Oral presentation is based on the written staff report; please refer to your copy.
Chairman Beil opened the public hearing for the following discussion:
Commissioner Glasgow — This is an association, it's not a walk -in retail type of
business so I don't see any reason why they would need a 20- minute parking
zone. Across the street is Orange Glass that has walk -in business that would
need 20 minute parking.
ACTION: Denied the request.
MOTION: Glasgow
SECOND: King
AYES: Unanimous
End of Consideration Itemsk
V. ADMINISTRATIVE REPORTS
None this month.
g City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
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VI. ADJOURNMENT
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After discussion of today's Agenda the City Traffic Commission meeting was
concluded, and as there were no further requests for action under Oral
Presentations, the Chairman adjourned this session of the City Traffic
Commission.
The next meeting of the City Traffic Commission is scheduled:
5:30 P.M.
Wednesday - February 12, 2014
Respectfully submitted,
Phyllis Then, Recording Secretary
Traffic Engineering Division
then @citvoforanee.or
CITY OF ORANGE
PUBLIC WORKS DEPARTMENT
300 E. CHAPMAN AVENUE
ORANGE CA 92866
PH: (714) 744 -5536
FAX: (714) 744 -5573
`g City of Tape #CTC -33.07 of this City Traffic Commission meeting is available for your review.
rang Please contact the Recording Secretary at (714) 744 -5536 in this regard, advance notice is appreciated.
Public Works Department 4W
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