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08-11-1993 - Minutes TC �y�,�s �,.,� CITY OF ORANGE MINUTES OF A REGULAR MEETING CITY TRAFFIC COMMISSION Date of Meeting: Au u._� st 1 l, 1993 ROLL CALL-PRESENT-COMMISSIONERS: D.YARGER,J.FORTIER,N.HOWER,F. SCIARRA ABSENT -COMMISSIONERS: B.LEMING STAFF: B.DENNIS,B.HERRICK,LT.E. TLTNSTALL, C. GLASS, D. ALLENBACH P. THEN I. APPROVAL OF MINUTES June 9, 1993 - APPROVE as published by Recording Secretary MOTION: F. SCIARRA SECOND: J. FORTIER AYES: UNANIMOUS II. CONSENT CALENDAR l. Request for '20 Minute' P�rking adjacent to 171 S. Anita Dr. Thomas E. Skinner Assistant Asset Manager Newport Equity Capital Corporation 171 S. Anita Dr. Orange, CA 92668 Oral presentation was bczsed on the written stc�ff report,please refer to your eopy. Chc�i��n�an YaTger oper7ed the plrblic hearir�g fo�• the following discussion of thzs request. Thomas Skinner - Newport Ec�uitv Capital Cor� (171 S Anita Dr.l - My request now instead of '20 Minute' would be for '2 Hour' parking, after consulting with the building tenants that is the time limit they would desire. Someone is parking a very large trailer on the street which blocks visibility of traffic when exiting the parking lot (submits photos of problenz ar�ea bz�t they do not show the offending vehicle). Chairman Yar�er - You say they are only parking here one day a week? Thomas Skinner - We can count on it once a week, sometimes it's there 2-3 times a week. Chairman Yar�er - Is that parked on the south side frontage or the north side frontage? Thomas Skinner- South side. Commissioner Sciarra- Is that a trailer or a motorhome? Thomas Skinner - It takes a truck to move it so I guess it would be more like a motorhome/trailer. Chairman Yarger - Does it look like a commercial trailer, is it a big box type? Does it have a name on the side. Thomas Skinner -It looks like a big box, and there is no name on it. Chairman Yar�er - When we go into different areas with limited time parking we run into trouble enforcing because of the cut-backs. Commissioner Fortier - What is the problem with the parking that you would need this limited hour parking? From what I'm hearing there is ample parking available in the back and when we get concerned is when there is no parking of�street we would look into this _ type of time limit parking. Thomas Skinner - The problem isn't that there isn't anywhere on-site for parking, it's because the person with the trailer cannot fit into any of the parking lot spaces and he chooses to park in front of the building which obstructs view when exiting the parking structure. Chairman Yar�er-But you have 2 ways to go in and out, I can see the south exit could be obstructed but most of your people could exit the north driveway and not have any obstruction whatsoever. Thomas Skinner -Most people don't exit one driveway consistently. Dave Allenbach - If this is a request for 'time limit' parking, we would have to recommend that you deny that type of request because the building does have ample off street parking. If the CTC wanted to consider '2 Hour" parking it really should be considered for the entire street because this particular problem really is just going to shift to somebody else's doorstep. With regard to the sight distance problem of the trailer, which is a different issue than time limit parking, that could be resolved with some red curb at the driveway's to provide some sight distance. There is an ordinance prohibiting the parking of commercial trailers on public streets unless they are loading or un-loading merchandise, I believe you can park a recreational vehicle type trailer on the street provided it is not hooked up electrically to a business/residence for living purposes. Chairman Yar�er - I recommend that the next time that vehicle is parked there that you call the Police Dept. Commissioner Sciarra - Actually the trailer is a different situation entirely. I have to go along with the engineer's report and findings that the parking lot is only 50% full and I don't see that red curb is warranted. 2 Commissioner Fortier - I agree with you, however, if Mr. Skinner would like to remain in the audience until Lt. Tunstall rejoins the meeting, perhaps he may of�er a suggestion on a way to resolve your problem. RECOMMENDATION: That the CTC, by motion DENY the request. MOTION: D. YARGER SECOND: F. SCIARR.A AYES: UNAI�IMOUS 2. Request for a 'driveway vision' zone at 739 N. Batavia St. Barbara Hicks 1372 La Colina Dr. Tustin, CA 92680 There was no discussion on this item. RECOMMENDATION: That the CTC, by motion APPROVE the request. MOTION: D. YARGER SECOND: N. HOWER AYES: UNAI�TIMOUS 3. Request for short term p�rking on the west side of Citrus St. adjacent to Sunland Credit Union, located at 1010 W. Chapman Ave. Lisa VanPatten, V.P. National Express Funding Corp. 1010 W. Chapman Ave., Suite 200 Orange, CA 92668 Due to a mal.fu.nction with the t.ape recorder oral testimony of this item wasn't recorded. RECOMMENDATION: That the CTC, by motion DENY the request. MOTION: D. YARGER SECOND: �. SCIARRA AYES: UNANIMOUS 3 III. CONSIDERATION ITEMS A. Request for a 'Neighborhood Parking Permit' Program on both sides of Shaffer St. between Katella Ave. and Trenton Ave. Louis Peters 1422 N. Shaffer St. Orange, CA 92667 Oral p�esentation is based on the written staff report, please refer to you.r copy. Chairrnan Yarger opened the public heccring for discussion of th.is item. Due to a malfunction with the tape �eco�ding equipment, not all of the beginning of the discussion wa.s �ecorded. Louis Peters, 1422 N. Shaffer St. - The residents that signed would be amenable to paying the fees, I for one will be more than happy to and for 3-4 vehicles that I have. It's just something we definitely need, there is a value to our homes and the neighborhood is in transition and we would like to keep it but we can't, the street is just totally marked with a grease strip that you wouldn't believe and I'll clean it myself, I'm not asking the City to do it but just allow me to have no cars there so I can clean it. Chairman Yar�er - You have capabilities of parking 4 vehicles on your property; 2 in the garage and 2 in the driveway. Louis Peters - That's correct. Chairman Yarger - So in essence what you're saying is that you want permit parking because you don't want people parking in front of your house from the apartments, is that correct? Louis Peters - We have an on-going problem, that is correct. Cominissioner Fortier - How did you find the capacity on the street at the time you conducted the traf�'ic survey? Dave Allenbach-We drove the street several times during the day. We were out there in the early evening, admittedly we may have been out there too early to catch the demand for the evening as were out there around 5:00 - 5:15 p.m. At that time the demand was fairly light, there was a total of 18 vehicles parked along this section of Shaffer St. There was plenty of capacity left for additional vehicles to park on the street. Commissioner Hower-What time is the main problem? Louis Peters - It starts about 7:00 p.m., and then on weekends there will be automobiles 3/4 of the way down the block. 4 Commissioner Hower-I drove through there last night at 7:20 p.m. and there were only 6 cars parked on the street and at 8:20 p.m. there were only 7 cars parked there. This morning at 9:40 a.m. there were only 7 cars parked on the street; so there were no problems at that time that I could see. Commissioner Sciarra - It appears then that there is no problem with the availability of parking but the applicant wants the permit parking to keep the apartment dwellers from parking in the street. Is that correct? Louis Peters - I would like to be able to control the parking, who parks on the street. When somebody throws a dirty diaper on your front lawn or attempts to urinate/defecate on your lawn, is that prejudicial on my part because I'm trying to keep the apartment dwellers away? Maybe it is I don't know, I'm making a call that I don't want this to affect my property, I don't need my 5 children to see this, I don't need the trash thrown that these people leave, they have no concern of what they're doing. My neighbor and I go out and have to sweep the street, empty oil cans and the like. A man walks down to my - home carrying an empty liter 7-Up bottle with water from my hose and fills his radiator and then he throws the empty bottle on my lawn. I didn°t spend $200,000 +to buy a gas station, I didn't invite him, if he comes and asks me that is a different story but this is what we're faced with. Chairman Yar�er - It sounds like inore than a parking problem to me, these are social problems and people are looking for a tra�'ic solution. We agree that you have a problem but it's not really traffic, that is a public street. Louis Peters - I understand that, I spoke with Susan Tulley of Code Enforcement earlier and she went out and spot checked those apartments and there are more people in the apartments than there is supposed to be. I cannot control that, but maybe having permit parking as a venue for other social issues, but at least we can have our destiny somewhat under our own control. I can't change people but we are trying to do this the best way we can and this is an avenue that we felt would be viable for the neighborhood and the neighborhood is 100% in favor of this. Chairman Yarger-How long has it been since you've spoken with Code Enforcement? Louis Peters - Susan hasn't returned any of my calls, and she indicated to me that with the recent budget cuts she might not be around after July, however, I have kept notes of my calls to the Code Enforcement Dept. and dates of such. Bernie Dennis - Susan won't be returning your calls as she is no longer employed by the City, and the Code Enforcement Dept. and their availability to do this kind of work has been severely curtailed. 5 ; Rudy Lovato, 1451 N. Shaffer St. - I'm about 6 houses down from the apartments. As the economy recovers from its current recession is that there will be alot more people jammed into those apartments and they will spread down as far as we are. I feel that the same thing applies in that we have to take pride in our neighborhood, we've seen the value of our property go down considerably because of insidious attack of apartments by a low element of people who are not available to afford an apartment of their own, I know that from talking with the mailman he complains that when delivering mail there are many people's mail address to the same apartment. Right across the street from me is a house that has 2 families occupying it and he has 6-7 cars, trucks parking there all the time. My next door neighbor's have expanded their driveway to 5 car lengths wide, if all these people only parked 2 cars in their driveway and had to put the rest on the street it would decrease the number of available parking spaces. 1412 N. Shaffer - There are cars parked on the street blocking my driveway and I wasn't able to get out until I tracked down the owner of the cars and asked them to move. We have a patio in the front of our property and these people come onto our property and sit there and visit with each other, do whatever they care to do, and leave whatever trash they care to leave. It's true that it is a social problem, but it is traff'ic related when I can't get out of my own driveway. Commissioner Fortier - I understand this is upsetting to you, but as we look at this issue all the reports to us show there is adequate parking available on the street. Now you inay have undesirable people parking in front of your home, people blocking your driveway, parking illegally but you see that is another matter. Bernie Dennis - About 2 years ago the City Council, particularly Councilwoman Coontz convened a neighborhood meeting involving some of the residents here today but it was specifically to address a variety of problems on Shaffer St. in this area. At that point in time with quite a variety of staff present, Traff'ic Engineering, Police Dept., Code Enforcement, the residents were advised that the city would take very positive actions in trying to reduce the overcrowding in the apartment complexes and through that effort, hopefully reduce among other things, the on-street parking deinand emanating from the apartinents onto the R-1 section of the Shaffer St. area. The Code Enforcement staff began that procedure, the Police began their procedure in doing alot of things, as you will recall from a couple of years ago we took some actions in regard to signing, and other options, but unfortunately I think for the people involved, all of these expectations didn't materialize. There is, to the best of my knowledge, no continuing effort or no effort at this point in time to resolve the overcrowding issue. In this area you are dealing with two distinctly dif�erent landlords, each of which have a particular philosophy; one landlord was very cooperative and one was absolutely uncooperative. Although I share, what I believe to be the opinion of the Coinmission that this is probably a social problem, I can't help but feel in the same respect that maybe the City inadvertently let these folks down. I'm not sure that we have fulfilled the rest of our obligation and that was to resolve or to attempt to resolve the source of the problem, the overcrowding in the apartment complexes. Commissioner Hower - Perhaps then we should send this to the City Council, which is a body that could address some of these other problems, and let them solve this. 6 Chairman Yarger - I worry, with the cut-backs in the City, if there are permits who will enforce it? Do we have enough law enforcement, the Police Dept. says they are having problems. Commissioner Fortier - I agree that these people have a problem, but I think it should go to the Council and they should be the one's to help them. It is not the removal of parking to solve this problem. Louis Peters - I don't see how the City Council is going to do anything to solve this now. We're willing to take that responsibility to take on this additional complication of how we have to live and in addition it may take additional manpower to enforce this it is additional income to the City when you put a ticket on a car you get income from it. Chairman Yarger - That doesn't really make a difference, the City doesn't get all the money collected froin fines. Chairman Yar�-When will this item come up before the Council? Phyllis Then - We can schedule this for August 24th, or on September 14, 1993, if you want this on an evening session. Commissioner Sciarra - The use of the parking permits in this case, I feel, is unwarranted and doesn't meet the true intent of a permit parking program; and I would like to make a motion that we deny the request. RECOMMENDATION: That the CTC, by motion DENY the request for a neighborhood parking perinit program on this segment of Shaffer St. And I recommend that we send this to the City Council for their review at a 7:00 p.m. Session, and that notices be sent to all affected area residents. MOTION: F. SCIARRA SECOND: N. HOWER AYE S: UNANIMOUS NOES : NONE B. Request for a '3-Way' STOP control at the intersection of Loma St. and Serrano Ave. Tanet Morgan Cardinal Property Management, Inc. 1290 N. Hancock St., Suite 103 Anaheim; CA 92807 Oral presentation is based on written staff report, please refer to your copy. Chairman Yarger opened the public hearing for the following discussion of this item. 7 Christina Stichler, 6642 E. Waterton - The Mabury Ranch HOA Board of Director's would like to go on record that we would like the STOP sign put in as soon as possible as we have concerns with the on-going safety in our community. We have 400 homes with only one access in and out of the area. With the continuation of Serrano we may never get that because of Woodcrest Development going underneath and the road development contingent upon that. With the opening of Loma we will see considerably more tra�ic of people coming across the hill and down to the beach via Jamboree and missing all the freeway traffic. We also are seeing traffc now of commuters going through our neighborhood. We would like to strongly urge the Commission to actively look at this with the assumption of keeping our on-going safety in mind and that installing this now will keep that safety during the process of opening up Loma St. Bernie Dennis - Regarding the signalization, it's very probable that we'll bring the signal for that intersection down, time-wise. Christina Stichler - When I came out this afternoon it was real scary coming through the construction area, thank goodness they had a flagman there. Chai�man Ya.rger closed the public hea�ing and �eturned the item to the Commission for their comments arr.d a motion. RECOlVIlVIENDATION- That this be DEFERRED until such a time as traff'ic warrants it be reconsidered. MOTION: N. HOWER SECOND: J. FORTIER AYES: UNANIMOUS C. Request for a '3-Way' STOP at the intersection of Grand St. and Trenton Ave. Debbie Rivet 1482 N. Grand St. � Orange, CA 92667 Oral present.a.t.ion is based on th.e written sta.ff re�no�t., please refer to your copy. Chaa���an Yc��ger opened the public hec�ring for the following discussion of this request. Rudora Saul, 1472 N. Grand St. - I would like to ask when the speed zone survey was done, I was almost hit yesterday crossing the street. Due to the apartment, which we're having the same problem as the people on Shaffer St. are having, tons of cars are parked on the street and there is poor visibility when trying to make a left turn. Chairman Yar�er-Which direction are these cars coming from? s Rudora Saul - They are coming from Cambridge to Glassell, so it is from both east and west. There is alot of tra�c, because of the apartments. One house on Trenton has 22 people living in it and they have 9 cars; I haven't been able to speak with them because they act like they can't speak English, but th�y have been gracious enough to heed my note to leave the front of my property for my family and friends to park. The people at this house also have about 8 children under the age of 3 that are allowed to play in the parkway strip with all the oncoming tra�c speeding through the intersection. The STOP sign is for the safety of the children. Like I said, the visibility of cars trying to make a left turn orito Trenton is very poor and people are going so fast, I think a STOP sign would slow people down, Chairman Yar�-How far is it frorn Grand to Glassell St.? Dave Allenbach-�t's about-6�Q feet. Chairaman Yar�er � As far as exiting Grand onto Trenton �here is red curbing to afford visibility, is that correct? - Dave Allenbach - Yes sir, u�e recently installed red curb at this intersection to enhance motorists visibility. Chairman Yarger-Were the other neighbors notified abo�t the 3-Way STOP? Rudora, Saul -I don't know, I received a lett�r and that's why T came today, ta support my other neighbors. Chairman Yar�er - When you start stopping venicles and starting them you are creating � m+are polluti+on, bot� from naise and fumes, �vhen you get people right on the corner where the STC�P sign g�es in they're the�ne's who will have to listen to the car as it stops and starts. It loaks like the people were .notified of the meeting but they didn't care to shaw up. � . Commissioner�art�er - STOP signs are not designed to control speed of traf�'ic, they are to assign rig��t-of-way on1y. Chairrt�a.n Yarger closed the publi� hea�in,g and �etu�ed the item to the Conzmission for their comments and a motion. RECOMMENDATION: Based on the fact that it doesn't meet warrants and there � seems to be a speeding problem rnostly and that STOP signs aren't designed to control speed, I recommend that we APPROVE a'1-Way' STOP installation. MOTION�:;:_; J. �ORTIER � SECONLI:�����_ N. HOWER AYES: �� UNANIMOUS .,,. . ss• 9 D. Request for 'protected left-turn phasing' at the intersection of Glassell St. and LaVeta Ave. Brendon Moore,Principal Holy Family Cathedral School 530 S. Glassell St. Orange, CA 92666 Oral report is based on the written staff report, please refer to your copy. There was no discussion on this item. I�ECOMMENDATION: That we APPRUVE the protected left-turn phasing and p��.�e �his pzoject on the Signal Priority List, ta be performed in conjunction with the anticipated G'ity prQject, oz when the ultimate right-of-way has been established. 1VIOTION. D. YARGER SECOND: F. SCIAIZRA - AYES: UNA,NIMOLTS TV. URAL �'RESENTATiONS PUBLIC PARTICIPATI�N - At the conc7usion of the meeting of items listed on this agenda, member� of th+� publ�c may address the �ity T�affic Commission regarding items � of interest to th� public that are within the subject jurisdiction of the City Traffic Commission. Commissioner Scrarra - Something has got�o be done about the tra�ic that builds up on Chapman and Tustin, especiai�y the eastbound�traf�ic an Chapman. When that bus make a stop there he really creates a bQttieneck situatian. If passible I'd like to see the cars moved out of the parking bay and have the bus relocated into that bay. No other comments were made. V. ADJOURNMENT Discussion of al1 today's Agenda items before the City Traf�ic Commission being complete, and there being no further requests for action under Oral Presentations, Chairman Yarger�.djourne�this session of the CTC to it's ne�regular meeting, scheduled for Septem�ber 8, 1993. Respectfully submitted, . Phyllis Then � `. �� Recording Secretary � � ' Traffic Engineering Division � '" ` " i � File Name:August 1�