2010-02-03 DRC Final MinutesCITY OF ORANGE
DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE
MINUTES -FINAL
February 3, 2010
Committee Members Present: Bill Cathcart
Tim McCormack
Craig Wheeler
Joe Woollett
Committee Members Absent: Adrienne Gladson
Staff in Attendance: Ed Knight, Assistant Community Development Director
Robert Garcia, Associate Planner
Sonal Thakur, Assistant Planner
Sandi Dimick, Recording Secretary
Administrative Session - 5:00 P.M.
Chair McCormack opened the Administrative Session with a review of the Agenda.
The Committee Members reviewed the minutes and noted corrections and changes.
There was no further discussion.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to adjourn the Administrative Session.
SECOND: Bill Cathcart
AYES: Bill Cathcart, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
MOTION CARRIED.
Administrative Session adjourned at 5:30 p.m.
Regular Session - 5:30 P.M.
ROLL CALL:
Committee Member Gladson was absent.
COMMITTEE REORGANIZATION WITH AN EFFECTIVE DATE OF FEBRUARY 17,
2010:
Election of Chairperson and Vice-Chairperson
Committee Member Woollett made a nomination of Committee Member Cathcart as
Chairperson and Committee Member Gladson to remain as Vice-Chairperson.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 2 of 12
SECOND: Craig Wheeler
AYES: Bill Cathcart, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
MOTION CARRIED.
PUBLIC PARTICIPATION:
Opportunity for members of the public to address the Design Review Committee on
matters not listed on the Agenda.
There was none.
CONSENT ITEMS:
All matters that are announced as Consent Items are considered to be routine by the
Design Review Committee and will be enacted by one motion. There will be no separate
discussion of said items unless members of the Design Review Committee, staff, or the
public request specific items to be removed from the Consent Items for separate action
(1) APPROVAL OF MINUTES: January 20, 2010
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to approve the minutes from the regular Design
Review Committee Meeting of January 20, 2010, with the changes and corrections noted during
the Administrative Session.
SECOND: Joe Woollett
.AWES: Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES; None
ABSTAIN: Bill Cathcart
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 3 of 12
AGENDA ITEMS:
Continued Items:
(2) DRC No. 4398-08 - FLAPPY JACK'S RESTAURANT
• A proposal for new landscaping on an existing commercial property for a new restaurant.
• 2848 N. Santiago Boulevard
• Staff Contact: Sonal Thakur, 714-744-7239, sthakur(cr~,cityoforan~e.or~
• Previous DRC Review: October 21, 2009
• DRC Action: Final Determination
Assistant Planner, Sonal Thakur, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Dann Mikkelsen, address on file, stated they had gone back through the plans and
eliminated about one-half of the material and coordinated the overall concept a little tighter. The
Eucalyptus had been brought back, although it was not something he had wanted to do. The
Palm tree was left in with the exception of the Palm tree in the expansion area. There would be
shading with the Brisbane along the freeway edge. There would still be space under the trees to
view the freeway. There would be some screening behind the restaurant without interfering with
any signage.
Public Comment
None.
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion by the Committee.
Committee Member Cathcart stated he had no major concerns with the proposed project. When
the Plaza project had been done, he had wanted to remove the Pine trees and put in Palm trees
and Dann had shown up with Pine trees. It was okay with him and he had wanted to point that
out. There were two different symbols for the same plant on the drawings.
Mr. Mikkelsen stated in changing the plant material he may have omitted that correction.
Committee Member Cathcart asked if any consideration was taken on the Pine trees, as the Pines
in the Plaza drip sap all over the cars?
Committee Member Wheeler asked if the applicant was using the same type of Pine tree?
Committee Member Cathcart stated yes, they were.
Chair McCormack stated the Pine trees would need to be trimmed in October to avoid the sap
problem.
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Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 4 of 12
Committee Member Cathcart stated he liked the current proposal much better than the previous
submittal.
Chair McCormack stated he had caught the same situation with the different symbols for the
same plants; it was okay to do, but it could confuse the contractor. He reviewed the plans with
the applicant and stated the plans looked good and he mirrored Committee Member Cathcart's
comment that the proposed plans were much better. On the sign he had noticed where the
screening was and the Lophostemon was brought all the way down to the ground which would
be very small.
Mr. Mikkelsen stated the plantings followed the grade and provided some erosion control.
Basically the intent was to bring in a low-water plant program.
Chair McCormack stated the only thing he had a question on, was there were plantings on a west
facing area and with another Tristania it would not block the sign, but would allow shade for the
area. Typically most architects would want an accent tree that was sculptural and could be lit,
and in adding a tree it would provide shade in the afternoon. He was not requiring another tree,
but suggesting the addition.
Mr. Mikkelsen stated a tree could be added. They could add a "Heritage" Sycamore tree to the
area.
Committee Member Wheeler stated there was an article on the Los Angeles County Arboretum
website about Liquid Amber trees and that they had been pushing Liquid Amber trees and that
they probably had made a mistake and in the proposed plans there was one very close to the
foundation.
Applicant, Larry Gibson, address on file, stated the plans called for taking that tree out as it was
breaking up the sidewalk.
Chair McCormack made a motion to approve DRC No. 4398-08, landscape plans for Flappy
Jack's Restaurant, subject to the conditions contained in the Staff Report and with the following
suggestion:
1. To add an accent tree and an additional Tristania to the plantings.
SECOND: Bill Cathcart
AYES: Bill Cathcart, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
MOTION CARRIED.
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Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 5 of 12
New Agenda Items:
(3) DRC No. 4171-06 - T-MOBILE WIRELESS FACILITY
• A proposal for installation of twelve (12) antennas, one (1) parabolic antenna, an
equipment shelter, and utility line trenching. The proposed project site is located within a
Special Linkage Area by the Central and Coastal Orange County Sub-Region of the
Natural Community Conservation Plan (NCCP).
• SCE Tower -South of Townsend Avenue between Crossgate and Rosemere
• Staff Contact: Robert Garcia, 714-744-7231, r~arcia(a~cit ofy orange.org
• DRC Action: Recommendation to the Planning Commission
Associate Planner, Robert Garcia, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Monica Moretta, address on file, stated she was representing T-Mobile and the project
brought before them was a proposal for an attachment of communication wires to an existing
Southern California Edison tower. T-Mobile worked with SCE to ensure the equipment would
be located in compliance with SCE guidelines. SCE had a master agreement with wireless
carriers regarding their compatibility. She was available for any questions the Committee
Members had.
Public Comment
None,
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion by the Committee.
Committee Member Cathcart stated in the Mitigated Negative Declaration (MND) it spoke to
lighting features associated with the proposed project. He could understand small fixtures used
for emergency or maintenance activities and he asked how often maintenance would occur at the
site?
Ms. Moretta stated maintenance would occur once a month. Unless there was an emergency,
normal maintenance took a couple of hours. If an antennae required replacement it would take
more time.
Committee Member Cathcart stated with the lights, he presumed most of the maintenance was
completed at night.
Ms. Moretta stated not necessarily. If the facility had problems at night there would be lighting
available in order to service the site at night. The maintenance agreement allowed T-Mobile
access to the site 24 hours a day.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 6 of 12
Committee Member Wheeler stated in reviewing other cell sites he could not recall approving a
site that had a chain link enclosure. He had realized that one had been approved at the north end
of Orange-Olive Road, which was a chain link enclosure.
Mr. Garcia stated there was also another one that had been approved at the SCE power plant on
East Chapman.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he took a look at the one on North Orange-Olive and it was
well maintained and had not looked too bad. He attempted to locate the tower from two different
points and the ground was not visible and he felt it would not be very visible on the proposed
project site. He would be comfortable with the chain link enclosure with the slats.
Ms. Moretta stated they followed the SCE requirements. SCE would allow a CMU enclosure,
however, there was an issue with graffiti and they would not be allowed to add any landscape as
SCE would prohibit that. They used the slats to mitigate the view of the equipment.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he wanted to add to the Conditions of Approval, a reference
to the mitigation measures included in the MND.
Committee Member Cathcart stated he presumed that the noise from the site would be noise
generated during the construction of the site and that once the site was completed there would
not be noise from the site.
Ms. Moretta stated there would be noise from the site during construction; after the site was up
and running the noise generated would be from the air conditioning units. The site would be
500' away from any residential structures and the enclosure also assisted in isolating the noise.
The air conditioning units were only active during high daytime temperatures.
Chair McCormack stated he had a question on page 23 of the MND. It stated a native mature
Sugar Bush (Rhus ovata) south of the project would be superficially trimmed as part of the
proposed project. He asked if there was anything contained in the document that would provide
the standards for how the plant would be pruned? He would want the plant pruned per
arboricultural standards and if the plant died it would need to be replaced. He wondered if that
requirement could be added as a condition?
Mr. Garcia stated he would review the mitigation measures.
Chair McCormack stated if the trimming was done incorrectly it could be a loss of habitat.
Ms. Moretta stated it could be replaced as long as the plant was outside of the tower. Her
understanding was that SCE was responsible for the maintenance of the area on the site. As the
construction area would be directly under the tower, if there was vegetation growth in the
construction area the plant could be moved somewhere else.
Committee Member Cathcart asked if Chair McCormack was concerned with the statement
"superficially trimmed."
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Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 7 of 12
Chair McCormack stated that was not an arboricultural term and he was not certain how that
related to limbs being cut. It appeared very vague and he wanted clarification.
Committee Member Woollett stated he was in concurrence with what had been discussed.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to recommend approval to the Planning
Commission of DRC No. 4171-06, T-Mobile Wireless Facility, subject to the conditions
contained in the Staff Report and with the additional conditions:
1. Reference of the mitigation measures listed in the Mitigated Negative Declaration.
2. The Sugar Bush be trimmed to arboreal cultural standards and if the Sugar bush was
damaged that a similar bush be planted.
SECOND: Tim McCormack
AYES: Bill Cathcart, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
MOTION CARRIED.
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Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 8 of 12
(4) DRC No. 4416-09 - T-MOBILE LA03006
• A proposal to locate a wireless communications facility in the form of a light standard
on the top level of an existing residential parking structure. An associated 8' tall
equipment enclosure is also proposed and would remove two parking spaces.
• 1235 W. Town & Country Road
• Staff Contact: Sonal Thakur, 714-744-7239, sthakur a,cit o~nge.org
• DRC Action: Recommendation to the Planning Commission
Assistant Planner, Sonal Thakur, presented a project overview consistent with the Staff Report.
Applicant, Monica Moretta, address on file, stated she was representing T-Mobile and the
proposed project was of a similar design that had been presented previously for the Verizon
Facility at the Windsor Apartments. They had wanted back in 2008 to combine the projects,
however, Verizon had been in an advanced project stage and T-Mobile had just begun. The
Verizon project had given them a footprint of the equipment enclosure and there was one light
standard available that they could utilize for their equipment installation. She presented photos
of the site and the equipment enclosure that they proposed to construct. She pointed out the
Verizon equipment that was mounted on the light standards and the equipment T-Mobile
proposed to install on the site. She had taken photos of the Verizon facility during construction
to allow the Committee Members to get a better understanding of how the cabinets were
installed. The equipment enclosure would be constructed of prefabricated steel that could be
painted any color. She presented photos of a finished equipment cabinet installation.
Public Comment
None.
Chair McCormack opened the item for discussion by the Committee.
Committee Member Woollett asked if any of the current DRC Members were on the Committee
when the project had been previously presented?
Committee Member Wheeler stated he was.
Committee Member Woollett stated the item had been discussed at great length and he thought it
was a good idea to match the other equipment. One of the primary concerns was the cabling and
where it would be placed and what it would look like. He would want a bit more information on
how the cable would be installed from the equipment cabinet to the pole.
Ms. Moretta presented a photo and stated there was separation between the two levels. T-Mobile
would be coring from the first level to the fourth level with conduit being run to the fourth level
with a coaxial separation from the cabinet to the light. There would be a cover next to the pole.
She presented a photo of the Verizon installation which would be similar to the equipment T-
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 9 of 12
Mobile would use. Any exposed coaxial cables would be covered. The cable would be fed
through the inside of the pole and come out where the antennas would be installed.
Committee Member Wheeler stated there would be a metal box on the footing that would
connect the cabling to the pole, it appeared to be very well done. It would be punched up
through the deck to a metal box and there would not be any exposed conduit.
Chair McCormack stated he had not visited the site and stated the cable could not go into the
footing.
Committee Member Wheeler stated the cable went next to the footing, next to the pedestal that
the light was on, into a metal box that was cored down through the slab. It ran along the ceiling
of the upper level to the equipment enclosure. He wanted to ensure that the cable on the north
elevation would only go as high as the ceiling of the lowest level, as they had not wanted any
exposed cable on the outside of the wall. He wanted it to be clear that the riser on the north
exterior wall only would go as high as the ceiling of the first level and the additional run would
be concealed.
Ms. Moretta stated it would be installed in that manner and it was also a requirement from the
property owner.
The Committee Members reviewed the drawings and the conduit and coaxial covers.
Committee Member Wheeler stated on the existing poles it had not appeared that the light
fixtures were extended away from the poles and the existing antennas were directly below the
light fixtures. He was concerned that the antennas would shadow the light.
Ms. Thakur stated that was something that had been discussed at the Staff level and Crime
Prevention had asked that a condition be added for the review of the photometric plans to ensure
sufficient lighting.
Committee Member Wheeler stated for the required photometrics that either Verizon or the
property owner might need to extend the lights out on the other light poles, as in the proposed
project. On the original installation it had not been done. He reviewed the photos of the Verizon
installation.
Chair McCormack asked if Verizon had moved their antennas down?
Ms. Moretta stated she was not certain if the same requirement or conditions had applied.
Chair McCormack stated his thought was that they should all be the same.
Committee Member Wheeler stated he agreed, but was not certain if they could ask that the
previous installation be corrected.
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Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 10 of 12
Ms. Moretta stated that through a photometric study they would move the lights out to comply,
however, they had no jurisdiction over the existing installation by Verizon. The property owner
might want them to make that change.
Committee Member Woollett stated that was not part of the proposed project.
Chair McCormack asked would the condition for the proposed project apply to the other light
standards?
Committee Member Woollett stated what was done was done; they could not require a change.
Ms. Thakur stated the proposed project would meet the photometric requirements and Staff could
contact the previous applicant to discuss possible mitigation measures.
Committee Member Cathcart asked if the requirement was aone-foot candle and if the previous
installation affected that, could the City ask that a change be made?
Ms. Thakur stated the previous project had gone through plan check; she was not certain whether
or not there was a photometric study completed. Through the entitlement process it was not a
condition.
Committee Member Wheeler stated it might be brought to the attention of the property owner for
liability reasons.
Ms. Thakur stated that was one of the reasons the condition had been added to the proposed
project, in light of the increase in residential robberies.
Chair McCormack stated if Verizon was reducing the amount of foot candles by their antenna
placement the other lights might need to be beefed up to make up for the lighting inadequacy.
That was not in their purview to deal with. that issue. He asked if the proposed project would be
using the same enclosures as Verizon?
Ms. Moretta stated they would be using the same equipment and specs from the Verizon
cabinets. Typically they had used block walls or chain link fences. Verizon had used the steel
enclosures and they wanted to match those. The steel would be painted and a gray color would
be used. They would be contacting the contractor to verify the color match. The T-Mobile
cabinet would be 18' x 14', 268 square feet.
Ms. Thakur stated the proposed project would be larger.
Ms. Moretta stated they would be using one light pole, vs. Verizon that had used three light
poles. The T-Mobile installation would use a quad antenna which would provide more power
and enable the capacity load to handle calls coming into the facility. Their installation would
have five equipment cabinets in the enclosure. They were next to the freeway and near the mall.
The calls that were coming into existing T-Mobile facilities were not able to handle the cell
traffic that was currently coming in from that area.
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Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 11 of 12
Chair McCormack asked if the enclosure had a top to it?
Ms. Moretta stated yes, it would be fully covered.
Committee Member Woollett stated there was a photo, it was not completely enclosed but it had
a cover. It was interesting to him that once they had decided it was a good idea to do something
in a certain way that it set a precedent to be done the same way again. There was the issue of
visual saturation. Just because an installation had been done one way it was not always good to
have more of the same.
Chair McCormack asked if the equipment enclosure would be exactly the same as the Verizon
equipment enclosures?
Ms. Moretta stated yes.
Committee Member Wheeler stated the enclosure would have horizontal panels. It was a bit
unfortunate in one of the exiting locations, as there was a slope and the equipment had horizontal
lines on a slope. He had not thought that would occur with the proposed installation. He felt the
proposed project was well done.
Committee Member Wheeler made a motion to recommend approval to the Planning
Commission of DRC No. 4416-09, T-Mobile LA03006, subject to the conditions contained in
the Staff Report and with the following additional conditions:
1. Clarify that the exterior power and signal riser on the north face of the parking structure
extend only to the height of the ceiling of the first parking level, at which point it will
move horizontally on the under side of the ceiling to the point close to or directly below
the proposed pole location.
2. Clarify that the light fixture use will be extended out beyond the proposed antennas as
shown on detail No. 2 of page A2.
And with the following suggestion:
1. Measures be taken to request a similar extended light arm provision for the existing light
standards and lighting.
SECOND: Bill Cathcart
AYES: Bill Cathcart, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
MOTION CARRIED.
City of Orange -Design Review Committee
Meeting Minutes for February 3, 2010
Page 12 of 12
ADJOURNMENT:
Chair McCormack made a motion to adjourn to the next regular scheduled meeting on
Wednesday, February 17, 2010. The meeting adjourned at 6:21 p.m.
SECOND: Bill Cathcart
AYES: Bill Cathcart, Tim McCormack, Craig Wheeler, Joe Woollett
NOES: None
ABSTAIN: None
ABSENT: Adrienne Gladson
MOTION CARRIED.